Title & Purpose

Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble:

for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand, Joel 2:1.


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and why we reject the many perversions of the Scriptures, including those so beloved of many neo-evangelicals at present such as ESV & NKJV.

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Monday, 23 January 2012

Irish Presbyterian Moderator a Bible denier!

Rev Ivan Patterson, moderator of the Presbyterian Church in Ireland, speaking on the Sunday Sequence programme yesterday [22nd Jan] in response to being asked if homosexual people would be condemned to hell by God, replied: No I don’t believe that ... I have no reason to believe that this is the case.

A report can also be read in today's Belfast Newsletter. Click here

It is hard to comprehend how any man who claims to be a minister of the gospel can with such a cavalier attitude deny the plain teaching of the Word of God and argue that those who practice these sins must have a place within the church.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 clearly teaches that the practitioners of certain sins will not inherit the kingdom of God:
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God
.

This is not the only place in the Word of God which this is clearly taught. Rom 1:23-32 is another clear example:
And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet
.
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them
.

You would wonder what language the God of heaven would have to use in His Word to convey to this world that these sins will bar someone from entering into heaven. 

What do these passages of Scripture mean if they do not warn of impending judgement for these and other types of sins?

There is the warning contained in 1 Cor 6:9 against being deceived on this matter. Ivan Patterson is simply 'deceived' to state that he does not believe that those who practice sodomy will be lost. 

He along with other Presbyterian ministers signed the Westminster Confession of Faith at their ordination which states regarding the Word of God:
The authority of the Holy Scripture, for which it ought to be believed and obeyed, dependeth not upon the testimony of any man, or Church; but wholly upon God (who is truth itself) the author thereof: and therefore it is to be received because it is the Word of God, Chapter I section 6;
The supreme judge by which all controversies of religion are to be determined, and all decrees of councils, opinions of ancient writers, doctrines of men, and private spirits, are to be examined; and in whose sentence we are to rest; can be no other but the Holy Spirit speaking in the Scripture, Chapter I section 10.

The Word of God is clear as indicated above. Does Ivan Patterson no longer believe what he signed those years ago? Was it cowardice and fear of man that made him unwilling to speak up for the Word of God and defend its truth?  

Furthermore he is far from fulsome in his belief that someone can change in his comments. The truth of the Gospel is that most certainly any sinner can be changed, no matter how sinful they may have been. It is not therapy someone battling with sin needs but regeneration by the power of the Holy Spirit. Therapy will not change the heart or nature of any individual. Jesus Christ regenerates sinners by giving them a new nature. With that new nature old things pass away and behold all things become new, 2 Cor 5:17

Paul the Apostle described himself as the chief of sinners and God mercifully saved and changed him. He can do the same for any sinner!

It is surely long past time for evangelicals to leave a denomination whose denominational leader makes such statements about sin. 

I wonder what else he doesn't believe in? Does he believe in the doctrine of eternal punishment? Does he believe in hell as a place at all? Does he believe in fire in hell or is he like Billy Graham and others on that point too? 

3 comments:

Anonymous said...

But your bible tells you to refrain from eating shell fish, wearing mixed fibres and cutting certain hair. Do you also abhor people who ignore these biblical commandments? How do you decide which bits of the Bible to hold dear and which bits are unimportant? What if you're wrong?

Do you keep slaves? Do you forbid your wife from speaking in church? Do you beat or kill non-believers?

Why not? Your bible says you should do all these things. Why is what consenting adults get up to behind closed doors more important than all of these things?

Wouldn't it be better for everyone and make the world a better and happier place if you all just stopped obsessing about homosexuals and what they do? It doesn't effect you, it doesn't hurt you, it has nothing to do with you.

k.

Anonymous said...

I very much doubt you'll have the integrity and courage to post my previous comment... but that just says it all, really. You religious people are an absolutely lovely bunch of people.

(sarcasm intended.)

Rev Brian McClung said...

Anonymous

I don't usually enter into a 'conversation' with someone who is so cowardly and ashamed that they can't put their name to what they say but I'll make an exception for you! Considering the nature of your comments it's no surprise that you wouldn't want to put your name to them! Your comments only display your ignorance of the Bible.

1. It seems that you don't know that there are actually 3 different laws in the Old Testament. [1] There is the moral law summarised in the ten commandments and binding upon all mankind. [2] There is the civil law binding only upon the Jews when they were a nation, to teach them that they were to be a separated people from all the other nations of the earth. [3] There is the ceremonial law that regulated the worship in Old Testament times and which was done away with when Jesus Christ came and fulfilled all the types and shadows in it.

The first set of examples you give are from the civil law which was only binding upon the Jews as a nation. Never let the facts get in the way of having ago that Christians and the Bible!

2. As to keeping slaves - The word only appears twice in the Bible, Jer 2:14; Rev 18:13. That is no surprise when you remember what Exodus 21:16 states: And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death. Paul applies this statement to all mankind, cf. 1 Timothy 1:10.

3. The Bible nowhere forbids my wife, or any woman, to speak in Church. If you care to read 1 Corinthians 11:5 you will see that it refers to women both praying and speaking in public worship. So again if you care to elaborate upon your statement it would be most interesting!

4. The same point about the civil law made above in point 1 applies to your comments about non believers.

5. Strangely the one thing you seem to have no problem with, ie sodomy, is the one thing that is forbidden in God's Word, both in the Old and New Testament, in the Moral Law that is binding upon all mankind for all of time. Sodomy is associated with apostasy and as the Bible's name for this sin suggests it brings judgment upon a nation.

Brian McClung